Big Baby String Height

[MikeRGR]

Hello Forum

  Could someone please tell me the correct string height for a 10 year old Big Baby ( example ; high E  8/64 at the 12th fret )
    Also with that in mind what is the difference between resetting the neck angle and sanding down the saddle.  Both will achieve a lower action

   Thanks for your help

Mike

[Paul60]

Hi Mike,

I was curious to know myself.

From what I can make out, you should be looking for around 5/64E 4/64e

All depends on your preference I guess. For me, I like my action as low as possible without buzzing.

Those settings of 5.64 4/64 are as high as I'd ever want to go. Maybe even a bit lower for me.

You would be better off shimming the neck of the BBT before sanding or hacking at the saddle. The break angle of the strings can be adversely affected. I think the Taylor Big Baby neck is easy to remove. Not sure where you can get the shims from though ?

Maybe someone here can chime in with that.

The Big Baby is a great guitar.

Cheers,

Paul.

[Jersey tuning]

Mike, are you 300 miles from the nearest authorized dealer? If not, having the neck reset will restore the proper relationship between the nut and bridge vis a vis break angles etc. and is a reversible action. Sanding down the saddle is irreversible.  You may want to sand AFTER resetting the neck if you wish lower-than-factory action.

But this is a forum.  Let's see what the real mavens have to say.

[MexicoMike]

IMO, the taylor neck is a great thing for when a neck reset would become necessary, whenever that might be.  But for action adjustments for typical use, I don't see it as valuable.  A saddle adjustment is simple and quick.  If you don't want to "adjust" the oem saddle, you can make a new one from whatever material you like in a few minutes. 

Action adjustments are, to me at least, almost a regular requirement.  FOr example, if you have the action set up for your playing with med gauge strings and then you switch to lights, the action will probably need adjustment to get optimum playing again.  Admittedly, if you are OK with a guitar's factory setting, it doesn't matter because it will probably work with a variety of string tensions because they are generally quite high.  But I have NEVER owned any brand of guitar that did not need the action adjusted (lowered) to suit my playing. 

Taking a guitar to a shop everytime you want to change the action for whatever reason just seems silly to me.  Shipping it for that purpose seems even less sensible because what if you get it back and then decide it's not what you wanted?

You will NEVER hear any difference in down angle off the saddle within any normal range of saddle adjustment.  If the saddle is too low THEN a reset is necessary because the neck/bridge relationship is wrong and THAT'S where the Taylor design is excellent...though folks like Martin and Collings would disagree...

[Jersey tuning]

Hey Mike thanks for the enlightenment.  I'm deathly afraid of doing anything to my guitars except for adjusting the saddle height on my two guitars with adjustable bridges.  Maybe it isn't so terminal after all!

[MexicoMike]

Making a new saddle - or several saddles - for any guitar has become a normal thing for me, whether it's a steel or nylon-string guitar.

Here's a quick example, for a gig tonight I decided to use my Martin HD28 as opposed to my Taylor 414ce.  I wanted to put new strings on the HD but discovered I didn't have a set of John Pearse Mediums but I had some sets of JP lights.  I strung up the lights but there was too much buzzing because the action, set up for the higher tension meds, was too low for the lights.  So I pulled out a spare saddle and 10 minutes later had the right action for the lights.

If you are new at this, I'd recommend you leave the oem saddle alone and buy some bone (or whatever) and make a new one.  That way, no matter how badly you screw up the first attempt, it has no affect at all since you can always put the original back in.  Same is true of nuts though they are more difficult since you have to set up the string spacing/file the notches.  Again - no big deal if you don't mess with the original.  Worst case - you ruined a little piece of bone! 

[Jersey tuning]

So "drop in" saddles come out that easily?

[azslacker]

  Most saddles will come out easily. Some fall out and others need just a little tug. Wrap a little masking tape around some pliers for a tight one. When sanding saddle bottons you have to be careful to sand evenly from bass to treble side. It helps to rotate it every few strokes. You tend to sand more from the side you push on. Also, make sure you are exactly 90 deg. to the sanding surface. It's easy to crown or sand and angle to the bottom. I tape the sandpaper to a heavy piece of glass.

  I use feeler gauges to measure string height at the 12th. After I decide what height I'm after, I figure out the difference between what I have, and what I want. You double that number and that is how much you remove from the saddle. I use an inexpensive dial caliper to measure the saddle as I sand it. Easier to work in 1000's than fractions. There is a little math involved, but if you work it out, you'll get it right the first time.

  They make shim stock for under the saddle if you go too far, or need to raise the height. my 312 has a shim under the saddle.

 

[Paul60]

Interesting stuff guys.

Does anyone know if the Taylor Big Baby, GS Mini & Baby come stock with shims under the saddle ?

I know some makes of guitar come standard with shims that can be easily removed to lower the saddle with no need to hack the saddle itself.

[michaelw]

Hello Forum

  Could someone please tell me the correct string height for a 10 year old Big Baby ( example ; high E  8/64 at the 12th fret )
    Also with that in mind what is the difference between resetting the neck angle and sanding down the saddle.  Both will achieve a lower action

   Thanks for your help

Mike

the factory set up for a steel 6 string is 6/64" E & 4/64" e, at the 12 fret with minimal neck relief, around .004 - .007" or so -
the big baby has a standard 25.5" scale length & came with elixir 80/20 nanoweb light gauge strings .012 - .053

if the neck is set with no relief & a straight edge placed along the frets, the correct
angle should result in the end of the straight edge contacting the top of the bridge -
if the edge overshoots the bridge, the angle is too steep & the neck is laid back or underset,
if the edge contact is below the bridge, the angle is too low & lowering the saddle may  help

by removing 1/32" from the saddle, the action should be lowered by 1/64" -
i would check the relief & action at the nut before going further &
you may want to get a replacement saddle to experiment with it

the saddle fit should be somewhat snug & should not fall out if the guitar is turned top side down

[michaelw]

Interesting stuff guys.

Does anyone know if the Taylor Big Baby, GS Mini & Baby come stock with shims under the saddle ? ...

i haven't seen any shims used under the saddle on any of the Taylors, but i have seen them with other makes
that have a UST pickup or a split saddle, where the acoustic tone probably would not be affected very much

[Paul60]

Thanks Michaelw,

Great advice & info.

[Jersey tuning]

Great info MW

[MexicoMike]

FWIW, don't consider the factory set up to be "right."   I would not consider the factory spec (Taylor, Martin, whoever) to be "right" any more than I would consider the seat adjustment on a car that left the factory to be "right."  It MIGHT be right for you and it might not.  Certainly it's a fairly common spec that works adequately for a variety of different styles and string tensions but usually you can do better by taylor-ing (NPI   )) it for your personal use.

I guess what I'm saying is that the reason to use that spec is if it works perfectly for YOU, not because it came from the factory set up that way.  They just make the guitar, you are the one who has to play it! 

[michaelw]

FWIW, don't consider the factory set up to be "right."   I would not consider the factory spec (Taylor, Martin, whoever) to be "right" any more than I would consider the seat adjustment on a car that left the factory to be "right."  It MIGHT be right for you and it might not.  Certainly it's a fairly common spec that works adequately for a variety of different styles and string tensions but usually you can do better by taylor-ing (NPI   )) it for your personal use.

I guess what I'm saying is that the reason to use that spec is if it works perfectly for YOU, not because it came from the factory set up that way.  They just make the guitar, you are the one who has to play it! 

factory specs are what manufacturer's consider to be acceptable & sometimes a new guitar warranty will be honored to reset the action to those specs -
other builders with glued in neckjoints can spec a low, medium or high saddle to "get around" having to
go through the intensive process of resetting a neck if the angle is extremely off & to allow some variance
trying their best to accommodate the needs a bluegrass flatpicker, a fingerstyle player & all inbetween

manufacturers are not required to perform a custom set up to each instrument before it leaves the factory because for the
most part they do not know who the end user is going to be, as the majority of them are not "pre-sold" but dealer stock -
there is a "medium", which allows adjustment for a certain range of variance & if more is required, then further options
can be explored, but there are extremes that can be detrimental to the tone & structural integrity of the instrument,
which the specs are meant to keep 95% or so of the general public safe from doing damage i.e. no truss rod tool included

from a car analogy, an understeer condition is safer for drivers that are not familiar with the limits of a
vehicle's dynamics, being able to approach, drive past & then recover/return to within the vehicle's limits -
suspension calibration, dampeners & spring rate, bushing durometer rating, control arm geometry, tire compound &
alignment specs on a base model vehicle are meant to be safe for most drivers under most conditions & when one
upgrades to the performance model with more power, handling package & summer tires, they'd better have an idea
of what they're doing, which needs to encompass more than knowing how to adjust the seat & where the fuel door is

the OP asked for the original factory specs, not what might work "best" -
he already knows that for him 8/64" is too high, which does not automatically mean 6/64" is ideal,
but it could, at the very least, be an improvement & a "baseline" to start from ... nothing more nothing less

ymmv