Taylor GS Mini sounds better than full sized Taylor - why?

[Rob_J]

I have a GS Mini spruce top that I love the sound of. It has a nice smooth tone, great sustain, and really good volume for such a small guitar. I had a 414ce that I just sold and upgraded to a newer 416ce Grand Symphony, and while it has good volume due to its large body size, it just doesn't sound as good (to my ears) as the Mini does. I'm talking about unplugged. The Mini sounds full and rich where the 416 seems to sound "thinner" for lack of a better word. Maybe I'm just not used to it? Maybe it just needs some break in time? Maybe I just need a good psychiatrist?

The Mini is a few years old where the 416 is a "new from the store" 2015 clearance model. Could it be that the 416 just needs a good setup or maybe different strings? It seems to play fine just as it came and has not had any kind of setup since bringing it home (just a couple of days ago). I'm assuming that it has Elixr strings from the factory but don't know what gauge. Most likely 13's? If I remember correctly, I actually have very light (10's) gauge Elixrs on the Mini and yet it sounds as loud as its bigger brother.

Am I wrong in thinking that the bigger full sized 416 should outshine the little Mini when it comes to tone?

[xtremearmor]

I can't imagine why it wouldn't unless it is badly in need of a setup, has old worn out strings, or as a last resort perhaps it will come to life after you strum it a bit.  Solid wood back and sides and a full GS body size should make it no contest.  And I have owned a GS Mini and an 816ce.

[zeebow]

hehe i don't know what to say on this one, except your strings are old on the GS, or that the mini is easier to play.

tone is subjective, maybe you just like the mini better, that's a lot easier on the wallet!

maybe the gs is more responsive to you? i have 12 fret GC that is more responsive (plays with a lighter touch) but when driven hard, my GA's are noticeably louder

and with solid tops, there are variations, but yes, a GS and GA should fed sound more full than a gs mini, quite eqsily

[mgap]

Curious situation.  Tell us did the old 414 sound better than the GS Mini?  Now you say the 416 is a 2015 clearance model, is there a chance the strings are old and worn out?  How does the 416 sound compared to the 414 you use to have?

[Rob_J]

Good observation regarding possible old strings. That could well be the issue. I'll change them and see what happens. As far as how the 414 sounded, I'd say it sounded fine. My reason for going to the larger bodied 416 is because I often play with a duo partner and with the 414 my playing style had to be altered to pick or strum harder than I normally do in order to be heard over his Guild. With fresh strings and some playing time I have no doubt that my new 416 will come around.

[SoCalSurf]

If you have the time and the interest, I would have somebody else play each guitar, blinding you to which one is being played. Hear it from an "outsider's" perspective. First maybe replace the strings as others mentioned.

I have a GS Mini and personally do not believe it sounds as good as others build it up to be. For a travel-size guitar, no doubt it is solid (figuratively, of course). But I think there is an awful lot of confirmation bias going on when a person plays a mini and has an expectation that it sounds as good as a full-size guitar.

I do think I am in the minority on this one, though. There definitely is a mystique surrounding the travel guitar with the full sound.

[xtremearmor]

If you have the time and the interest, I would have somebody else play each guitar, blinding you to which one is being played. Hear it from an "outsider's" perspective. First maybe replace the strings as others mentioned.

I have a GS Mini and personally do not believe it sounds as good as others build it up to be. For a travel-size guitar, no doubt it is solid (figuratively, of course). But I think there is an awful lot of confirmation bias going on when a person plays a mini and has an expectation that it sounds as good as a full-size guitar.

I do think I am in the minority on this one, though. There definitely is a mystique surrounding the travel guitar with the full sound.

I am in complete agreement with you actually.  Have caught myself doing it as well.

[Rob_J]

If you have the time and the interest, I would have somebody else play each guitar, blinding you to which one is being played. Hear it from an "outsider's" perspective. First maybe replace the strings as others mentioned.

Thanks for the wise advice SoCalSurf. I will make some time later today to change the strings. It will be a few days before I have a chance to get together with a friend who plays, but your's is an excellent suggestion and I will try that. We all have a tendency to hear what we want to hear or "think" we want to hear. A blind test is a good idea. As a side note, by your user name I'm assuming you could be a surf music fan/player?

[PaulWood]

What SoCalSurf said about the GS Mini. I think its a great little guitar at a great price but, tone-wise, it doesn't compare with my GC7e or my 614ce. Don't get me wrong, its great to play, albeit I find the recommended 13s a bit too heavy for my style, it just hasn't (can't have?) the tonal subtleties of the bigger, better appointed guitars. The difference is even more pronounced once you plug in. I believe my rosewood 2013 LTD GS Mini came with a cut-down version of the Expression system, but whatever it is, it amplifies fine but it is not tonally pleasing. I really enjoy the GS Mini, but its what it is -great value and great fun. Paul

[SoCalSurf]

As a side note, by your user name I'm assuming you could be a surf music fan/player?

Not so much. I love to surf and I love to play guitar, usually not at the same time.

[Guitarsan]

Good observation regarding possible old strings. That could well be the issue. I'll change them and see what happens. As far as how the 414 sounded, I'd say it sounded fine. My reason for going to the larger bodied 416 is because I often play with a duo partner and with the 414 my playing style had to be altered to pick or strum harder than I normally do in order to be heard over his Guild. With fresh strings and some playing time I have no doubt that my new 416 will come around.

First thing I thought of. Bet that's it. Prepare to "hello!" when they're on and tuned up. 

You're "supposed" to put medium strings on both of these models, but putting lights on both should be a fair comparison, except that smaller mini top takes less energy to get going, so may still be "as loud" give or take, if you use lights on both.

[Rob_J]

Okay - strings changed. Is there a BIG difference? No, but there IS a difference. The 416 sounds better than it did before the string change tone-wise but still doesn't sound appreciably louder than the Mini. As far as "supposed" to use medium strings, I realize THAT is the general rule but I find that with lighter strings I am able to bend notes much easier than I can with heaver strings. I use string bends fairly often in my playing so this is important for me. Of course, I also realize that with lighter strings there is a sacrifice in volume or at least that's what I'm told and I believe it to be true to some extent.

I now have 10's on the Mini and 12s on the 416 so I guess both have what is considered "light" strings. I had my wife listen while I strummed chords on both guitars with her looking the other way and asked her if one sounded louder than the other. She seemed to think they sounded pretty much the same.

Thanks for all of the input. I think it's probably just a matter of comparing the old "tried and true" to the "unfamiliar and new" and may be a case of judging apples along side oranges. At any rate, I'm pretty happy with both guitars now so I'll stop my whining and just enjoy them both.

[Jersey tuning]

Amen

[zeebow]

maybe you just have a super amazing mini

[SoCalSurf]

The only other thing I'll add is that volume and tone are two different things. Does it sound LOUDER or BETTER?

Either way, so glad you have two guitars two play interchangeably. Thanks for the update.